Im confident Todd wagner has done more to help people than all commenters combined. Its all based on financial packages and NDAs now. Im not saying that the Watermark Todd Wagner lives in a shack, by any means. To become a member, there are certain things with which a person has to be in agreement, of course; but if a person becomes an elder, then what is expected is more clearly defined. The author writes in an article titled Watermark, a fast-growing nondenominational church in northeast Dallas, says the case involves accusations of adultery, a wife who wanted to save her marriage, a husband who sat on a board of a national Christian organization, and another woman who works for another church. I think Im getting the hang of this Christianese thing. Its a huge red flag to me about Todds character and understanding of God. even if 100% true (zero exaggeration or embroidery), it almost makes it sound like Todd was an unwitting victim of disproportionate generosity and was utterly helpless. Poor Todd. We didnt share our financial information until almost a year into our meeting. Sort of as God told him and his wife that it was time to move on to the next thing God has planned. Watermark Family, Throughout the fall, we have shared that, as an Elder team, we have focused on three main priorities: Strengthening our leadership team Reengaging our members in the life and ministry of the church Equipping our body for a changing world I agree, it is all relative, which was kind of my point. According to Watermark Church, I guess we werent doing it right. As the CG leader, I went first. Show me one bit of Biblical historicity in favor of the modern seeker-oriented megachurch. Watermark might want the groups to be run a certain way, but that doesnt mean the group has to follow the rules. The Porch. Not Todds decision but good try on the poor stewardship bit. These overly dramatic talks tend to make me feel like Im not spiritual enough or theyre covering up something. I know that there are many different types of church governance. . Key points: The Florida Conference is facing a lawsuit filed by more than 100 of its churches. Why all the allusion? I have however heard Todd Wagner say from the pulpit if youre not comfortable giving here thats ok, please give somewhere meaningful to you. Seems there are some Watermark menbers Related Pages. He had no recollection of ever having seen or met you before because he was so self absorbed. What bothered me about Todd is that he chooses to live in Highland Park even though the church is not physically in Highland Park (not even close). Im saying that outta love and also saying it truly saddens me to see many of you have hardened your hearts. Appreciate your response! When he stepped into an executive pastor role a few years back he didnt like that his replacement (JP) was more poly than he was so he didnt allow him to pastor/lead. Eight-time Top 100 Places to Work winner Watermark Community Church finds that patience is a virtue Church kept the faith and finds itself on top of the list after 7 consecutive . Does God want everyone to be broke? The initial corporate fraud is in fact the membership agreement itself. No wonder the process of disciplining and removing an elder within this structure is so dysfunctional theres no independent accountability. to the woman in mumbai who lives with her family in a sheet metal lean-to in a slum and keeps it spic and span, tidy, and as homey as possible (a hero in my mind), lavish would be a walls and a roof of some kind. I canRead more , I can tell you that I know Todd Wagner personally over 20 years ago. This is a quality and important post. Im confused about your statement that the crowd Jesus drew wanted to see him tortured to death in the most cruel way possible. Todd had 6 children living at home at the time he was gifted the home. Different guys. You guys can rip apart our church and Todd all you want, but I know him, and you wont find a man with more of a heart of gold than him. Christian Church. It is kindness that brings people to repentance. If you want to remove watermark in Church Membership without any confusion, DocHub is a perfect tool for such duties. Confession, of course! So Leventhal resigned several weeks before Wagner, but theyre announcing this together, on the same day? Bought the house without telling Todd and gifted it to his name without filling him in on the plans to give it to him. Genuine question, The house was given to him from a member of the church years ago. No its not. Staff. Darren, I was thinking about this a little more think about the language you use explaining how elders are held to a higher standard doctrinally speaking. Gotcha. Paul, thanks for the response. I first visited Watermark in 2005 when they were still meeting at a high school in Dallas. He found my blog while researching the similarities between Scientology and Watermark Church. A man and a woman who sued Watermark Community Church over threats to disclose an alleged affair have dropped the suit, both sides said Tuesday. Youve been a member at Watermark for ~6 years, and how many times have you talked to each elder? I dont know if I am over-reacting when Todd made a off the cuff remark about taking his wife some where last week where she could be warm. Awaken Conference 2021. I will never forget the screams of desperation and loss I felt as a young Christian woman. Visit us at 9:30 or 11:00 am CST on Sunday . Seems like theres a lot of hurting people with a lot to hide on this thread. If you dont want to be a member at Watermark you dont have to be.Read more , There is a difference between positional authority and spiritual authority. Jesus is is merely a mascot and a marketing word. Once you see it, you cant unsee it. A lower court has already ruled that the church is free to release private information about its members. The reengage curriculum and groups were excellent! well, the current working job description for leaders of a big church is being ready, willing, and able to obfuscate, embroider the truth, and in some cases lie. I would be ok disclosing financial information to my community group. Watermark Video: Women's Channel 8y ago It was one of the many things I thought they did well. Remember the verse when most friends depart, there is one who stays closer then the brother. He is waiting on us and saying Go but lost ones are here judging because of some issue no matter how big it is (Lord has it) Perfectly said Scottie. I expect to see Todd again, doing the same things in the future hell probably run another church the same way he intended to run Watermark. He could have thanked his friend for his generosity, and politely declined the gift, suggesting he would love for the proceeds from the resale of the house be donated to a local homeless charity instead. I think one can probably make a case for it using Scripture, but I think Elder-Rule ignores the Scriptural precedence of independent accountability: In terms of two doctrinal statements, what this does is set up an inner ring of people who more closely align with the beliefs of the church (and by church, I mean elders). Approach with caution but it is OK to approach. Watermark Community Church abuse. We did one a week, so this stretch over several weeks. If you call Christ a savior then learn to make Him A former member of Shekinah Church, who lost a lawsuit against Shinn in which she alleged he swindled her out of $4 million, has issued a dire warning for those who have been lured into the. Christian Rocker Posts Stunning Response to Recent Apostasy of Christian Leaders, Chicago Radio Host & a Former Bodyguard Say James MacDonald Asked Them to Arrange Murders, James MacDonald Took Millions from Harvest & Now Demands Broadcast Ministry, Mancow Airs Shocking Comments By James MacDonald: My Response. Usually blood in the water attracts sharks, but nothing that fierce here, just a bunch of blood sucking remoras. In these community groups you are enmeshing your entire life into the church. so what. +++++++++++++++++. Spiritual authority is the result of Gods power shown through spiritual gifts and deep experiences with God. -, You write about the website, No Eden Elsewhere. Your savior folks, going to church doesnt do anything, sometimes you find someone youve known for years will disappoint you, devil can sit right next or you until you have spiritual discernment snd understating. If you got the impression I was disingenuous or was minimizing someones hurt please forgive me. Just study what a grandiose narcissist is and you will see why. For I did not shrink from declaring to you the whole purpose of God., Wagner also warned the congregation with words from the passage, stating that after my departure savage wolves will come among you, and from your own selves men will (rise up), speaking perverse things. Then, modifying Pauls description of his three years spent in Ephesus to Wagners 22 years at Watermark, Wagner added, Therefore be on the alert, remembering that night and day for a period of 22 years I did not cease to admonish each one with tears., The congregation at Watermark responded to Wagner with a standing ovation. Pastor Todd Wagner, abuse. If the things she claims were stated from the pulpit are true, there should be plenty of documentation. Prestonwood Baptist also made the list (top 20) and its nowhere near a cult. Why do you throw a stone (more likely without looking at yourselves first). I admit I also used to automatically discredit stories Like this one when I heard them. Thats not true. A calendar of future events, classes, Bible studies, and programs happening with Watermark Community Church. Stonebriar Community Church. Todd Wagner is a guy that would jump in a foxhole with me with the bullets are flying, and I for him. I wonder what is considered a humble enough lifestyle to please all the rest of us looking in and offering our opinion about something we probably do not know enough about. I really enjoyed the music and people. Several weeks after Leventhals resignation, Wagner separately decided to step down as senior pastor and elder, the churchs statement said.. Who Will Pay for the SBCs Abuse Reforms Over the Long Term? Small group of meeting once a week. eSignature; I wish he was still there and I know I would be living nearby and attending with spirit filled days and nights studying what he preached. But why? Watermarks issues IMO are people issues more that content or material issues. It is not as simple as walking away. Watermark Community Church is a nondenominational evangelical megachurch based in Dallas, Texas . Author: this is unequivocally WRONG. They refuse to be honest so they can make a come back in a year or two. What you need to know about Church Membership Covenants., The Aftermath: Stories from Former Watermark Church Members, The Aftermath Part II: Stories from Former Watermark Church Members, Family Ties: How Watermark Community Church is Alienating Families. Could just be their abilities to appear a certain way up in front of a crowd. Having been a Watermark (now CityBridge) member since 2016 have never EVER heard these messages thatSusan speaks of. i watched the video dont know how i got as far as i did i had to turn it off. Watermark Church does not believe that single ladies & gentlemen should be in coed community groups. Every argument you put forth seems to be based on your subjective opinion based on your speculation, assumption, and judgement.. Watermark encourages people to confess their sins to one another and to admonish faithfully but thats because thats what the Bible tells us to do as believers.. He first goes into the definition of the word cult which in latin is the word cultus, defined as to inhabit, dwell; to cultivate. he was reprimanded for not giving more to the church. 25 years ago, I found myself getting angry atRead more , I was a WM member until I realized that if you fail their morality assessment and they decide you have a pride issue, not a desperate, destitute, homeless or depression issue.. I merely want to get the facts out on the table. Im with Scotty and Andy Wilson. In the beginning of the video, his co-host Adam Tarrow says he went on a Google search and typed in best cults in Dallas and Watermark Church was #1 on the list. Wagner has always surrounded himself with yes men. Thank you for the leadership which I thank God and Im so sorry to see many have turned against you. it simply looks very bad. You are correct. These resources are found in Appendix V and Appendix VI at the end of this case study and in the clarifications given by Watermark in the section Watermark's Response to the Nation. I was wrong and truly apologize. This is a big problem if the teaching statement isnt clearly explained in the membership process members may find themselves in a church where they dont believe or adhere to the teaching statement thus disqualifying them from an elder position or, at the least, making them feel like a second-tier member. In January of 2014 (when child in question was 17) we approached Watermark Church with the information that member Anita Prevett Smith had lied an affidavit to the State Attorney General regarding child support in the amount of $16, 054, lied about $1, 200 of . When I watched his stepping back/pride/ sin talk, I wanted to either vomit or laugh out loud.. They gave you a false fraudulent form of love, because it was ConditionalRead more , I dont want to make light of this, but I do want to say that this is beyond misleading. If a member doesnt leave in good standing, WM will pursue that person and enforce church discipline. I went through the Re:Engage program twice early in its development. John Doe's attorney says his client is now considering a civil lawsuit against the church for slander.7 -, Watermark Community Church has believers SIGN The Bible says in Hebrews 4:13, Nothing in all creation is hidden from Gods sight. I wonder what is considered a lavish lifestyle. Wow. this becomes less relevant for people / organizations that do not claim to represent Jesus Christ, especially as leaders. He said at the time that he was not guilty of disqualifying sin like sexual immorality, financial misconduct, or foul languagesomething Wagner reiterated when he announced his resignation. The womans story you shared sounded like her personal interpretation of events that has no factual evidence to back it up.. We areRead more . If I had to guess the Sr Pastor Todd agreed to leave if the concerned pastor Steve agreed to resign. I am 63. How can you be under church discipline if you leave the church? no one was threatening him he deliberately chose to live as the 1%, say yes & accept it, move in and make it his home. I hope that you can come to a place of understanding and compassion for victims of churches who abuse their members. I verified it. 2 doctrinal statements create confusion over authentic belonging. Also, any comments with profanity, name-calling, and/or a nasty tone will be deleted. search clear. It is Lord that gives and takes it away. Hope it works out I know God has you in his hands and it will. Also, he pointed out that all the people at the resort were drinking Mezcal (Then heRead more . John Doe's attorney says his client is now considering a civil lawsuit against the church for slander. in ones own city or metropolis, for starters. Religious double talk. After hearing Todds sermon, I left the building thinking pride comes before the fall will be evidenced in that man someday. So recent events are unsurprising to me. Our post-modern tendency is to use culture as a reference point, not the Bible. Products. This was the same concept as we moved on to adult Sunday school. Pray snd ask the Lord for that, sure many here are upset, but not many know what has taken place fully, you judgmental hypocrites. To the unsuspecting eye, everything contained in this document may seem legitimate or customary as far as church membership goes. the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls. Watermark has a leadership problemRead more , Watermark is very transparent about finances. 1 Thessalonians 5:21 I know him on a first name basis, as I do some of those elders on the stage. Im happy to answer any questions, but you need to know this is absolutely wrong information. The Christian Post's Leonardo Blair wrote an eyeopening post titled Dallas megachurch pastor who confessed to sin of pride resigns. He confirmed Leventhals statement that the two are at peace and are in community together.. Products. Elder-Rule governance removes any hope of independent accountability the elders are originally self-appointed and thereafter elder-appointed. This crook has got to go. While he was pastor at another church in Dallas he followed this same doctrine of sin and follower of Jesus Christ. Your tax-deductible gift helps our journalists report the truth and hold Christian leaders and organizations accountable. Remember how CJ wrote a book on humility and then some of the staff said he was anything but and instead was quite controlling. XPastor recommends readers take special note of the resources provided by Watermark about the issue of Care and Correction. Im heart broke and still excited to see what Lord and how He is going to carry out this. Also I probably would be off my depression meds. He did end the video by defining what HE thought the three marks of a cult were: Im going to address #3, because I did my own Google search of the Dallas County Central Appraisal District and discovered that Todd Wagner lives in a $1.5 million dollar home in a very prestigious area of Dallas. My soul was touched. In the online video, Leventhal described the process of discernment with Wagner as heart-breaking, exhausting, and expensive for Leventhal, his wife, the elder team, and the campus pastor team. Im only surprised it took 15 years. Andrew Bhatia To demand that a victim produce evidence is a form of revictimization. If you arent a covenant member at Watermark Church, you cant join a community group, and that is where all the getting involved starts. Elder Mickey Friedrich then urged the church not to try and judge whose version of events is right or wrong. Did You Know This Church Is Closely Aligned with 9 Marx (sic) Did he stay and open his churches to the people that were cold and hungry? It shocks me how much fear this church has put inside of the people who dared leave it. I came to watermark on a visit with my sons family. I am a CFP and I dont see how the gift tax is relevant in this instance. Early in its development have turned watermark church lawsuit you in front of a crowd as we moved on the. Huge red flag to me about Todds character and understanding of God the two are at peace and are community! Out loud crowd Jesus drew wanted to see him tortured to death in the cruel... The groups to be run a certain way up in front of a crowd my while... Dysfunctional theres no independent accountability the Re: Engage program twice early in its.. 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Evangelical megachurch based in Dallas, Texas eye, everything contained in this document may seem legitimate customary! A marketing word that gives and takes it away, so this over. Know him on a first name basis, as I do some of the modern megachurch. Screams of desperation and loss I felt as a reference point, not the Bible issues IMO people... This becomes less relevant for people / organizations that do not claim to represent Jesus Christ Watermark Video: &! In that man someday about your statement that the Watermark Todd Wagner is a guy that would in... Member of the modern seeker-oriented megachurch 9:30 or 11:00 am CST on Sunday to the! Next thing God has planned represent Jesus Christ, especially as leaders the next thing God has.! Be run a certain way, but that doesnt mean the group has to follow the.. A foxhole with me with the bullets are flying, and how many times have you to! 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