I called Simon Motorsports and they said they can do it but I need to remove the restrictor plate. 2. Since the restrictor plates have been in use cars have still flown into the catch fence that protects the fans. Nobody knows exactly what to expect, Stewart-Haas Racing team co-owner Tony Stewart said. 2023 Advance Local Media LLC. Long story short, I failed to install the exhaust restrictor plates in the new intake gaskets going on my 350. (I don't know if this expression means anything in the US, in France it means wanting to reinvent simple things that have existed for a long time and I find it very appropriate in this case ). The biggest change with the air restriction is in terminology, though, since spacer tracks doesnt roll off the tongue the same way plate tracks does. While simple in their design, also came a problem. different design but also have the valve which close the hole into the brass plate. The date was Oct. 7, 2012, and I was standing in the Sprint Cup garage just moments after . You know how it is when youre on the highway and they check up right in front of you. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. It would run cold and throw a check engine light for low coolant temp when coasting down hill. As a safety measure to reduce speeds at the two high-banked superspeedways (Daytona and Talladega), restrictor plates are used. As cars are closer and drivers are more aggressive, a mistake will create a bigger crash. Flowkooler, where I originally purchased all of those Thermostats, came Second. To fit either restrictor: Remove the 4 screws holding the PCB to the joystick body. YouTubes privacy policy is available here and YouTubes terms of service is available here. But that is a good problem to have.. Replies and comments they make will be collapsed/hidden by default. Restrictor plates will be used in this race just as they have been in each of the last 31 years. A restrictor plate is a flat 1/8" piece of aluminum with 4 holes cut the same size. On a spacer, theyre conical in shape, changing things like throttle response and power numbers. ME: Since you said to use mags with restrictor plates, will this limit overall length of cartridges I can use? Restrictor plates are used at NASCAR's super-speedways, including Daytona and Talladega, to slow cars down. Tapered spacers are precisely machined and provide much more even air distribution, essentially making them more efficient. Thats a good thing, too, because latest example of one of those breakdowns is over something thats changing in NASCARs top series for the first time in 32 years: A move from restrictor plates to tapered spacers at its two biggest ovals, Daytona International Speedway and Talladega Superspeedway. The other one (but not in stock) ist this https://www.summitracing.com/parts/bra-333-180sub, "with Bypass" .Thanks.Eugen. If this were the case let's just have them design it so it won't fail. With a plate the teams still get to use their tunes and nascar does not have to worry about it. This is about the minimum size you should use. . The restrictor plate must be placed between the throttle body and plenum. Save . The spoiler, evident from the Fox animation below, is also massivelike it has been all year. A 0.922-inch spacer will be used at all oval tracks 1.33 miles and above, which will decrease engine horsepower to about 550. There are such a tremendously small number of actual t-stat failures that it is not worth thinking about. Larry Mac needs just 60 Seconds of your time to explain the difference between tapered spacers and restrictor plates. With the cars being fuel injected I don't see a use for restrictor plates. They seem like a very good idea though I can see some problems inherent to the design when trying to troubleshoot an overheating problem and the problem isn't the thermostat. If you purchase a product or register for an account through one of the links on our site, we may receive compensation. NASCAR's expectation is that reducing horsepower in connection with a larger spoiler that creates more downforce will slow the cars down, lead to more stability for drivers and produce tighter racing. For the first time since 1987, NASCAR will race at Talladega Superspeedway without restrictor plates. Are restrictor plates still used? This has been the case as a result of Bobby Allisons crash at Talladega Superspeedway in May of 1987 that resulted in him being sent airborne into the catch fence. In flow control applications, orifice plates are used as restriction devices to regulate fluid flow or reduce the flowing pressure downstream of the orifice plate. I made one with a restrictor hole dia of .28 in and another one with a .400 in hole diameter. Estimated Ship Date: Today. We cant get away from it. NASCAR seems to try to keep the average la Continue Reading Related questions More answers below Anthony Perez . If left to their own devices, the teams would have the cars going 240+mph. 25, 2021, 7:05 a.m. During a 1987 race at Talladega Superspeedway, Bobby Allison went airborne -- forcing NASCAR to change the way it raced at certain tracks. I still create the 'Brass By-Pass Restrictor Plates', offered on Ebay. There is still a few issues I have to address but I have to say I am happy with the results. A restrictor plate (or the tapered spacer) slows cars down by preventing them from bring air into the engine as quickly as without the plate or spacer. Hey, calm down, I just said that the thermostat sold by Summit has the same dimensions as those sold by Robertshaw and Flowkooler. Real NASCAR racing, real fast. Published: Apr. http://s101.photobucket.com/albums/m41/convincor/, http://www.factoryfivebuild.wordpress.com/, http://www.ffcars.com/forums/showthread.php?t=249601, http://www.motoradusa.com/products/failsafethermo/index.html. Then rename it to .FAST.CUP.SIM or FAST.CTS.SIM or whatever physics that you run. Thus, it effectively limits the acceleration and power the engine can produce. Estimated Ship Date: Today. The cataclysmic gloom and doom coming to NASCAR's restrictor-plate tracks is inevitable. These are 8 way joysticks and ordinarily are very difficult to use for games like PacMan. What are the Pros & Cons of Magnesium vs Aluminum Wheels, Forum Sponsorship & Banner Ad Information. I had a fail safe thermostat in my 2011 Ram 1500. Oh great, I'll waste another half an hour trying to find them..ahhh, gotem. Go to players folder - tracks - setups - find your setup. Now.where did I put those pliers? And usually when theres more crashes, theres more conflict. Look on ebay Germany : https://www.ebay.de/itm/185792693221. As speeds were getting faster and more dangerous, NASCAR began its use of the restrictor plate as a safety precaution without taking away the competitive nature of the race itself. UUUUUUUUUH.I'll never get this built. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. We're sorry. FWIW, an appropriately-sized carb will give more even cylinder-to-cylinder mixture, be easier to tune and will be more consistent. "Having a restrictor-plate package, open package, this new package, we're all excited to see what it produces. Great, thanks for the link, haven't found that yet in my last searches! We can't get away from it. There was a lot of engine inventory already out there. Octagonal Restrictor: This can be left in place and used in either 4 or 8-way mode with no need to move the plate between each mode. With the rules changes, the target horsepower becomes 550, but the aerodynamic devices included in the new package that will be used for these three races are expected to offset that as far as the speed is concerned, effectively meaning that the racing should still be similar to what it currently is at these two tracks. Tapered spacers have been used in NASCARs Cup Series since 2015, when a 1.170-inch aluminum block reduced horsepower from about 850 to approximately 725 at several tracks. Might have to experiment with the right size hole to reach the right temp.Hmmmmmmm. if it aint broke dont fix it. Try going 180. Now thats doing your business in luxury. "I probably contributed to restrictor plates quite a bit," Elliott said. So it will be interesting. Sunday's Daytona 500 will be the final NASCAR race for horsepower-sapping restrictor plates, which have been in use since 1988. . I noticed the summit thermostat listing contains in the description the word SUBSTITUTE. NASCAR fans and drivers, for the most part, have, grudgingly accepted the use of restrictor plates at Daytona and Talladega. Over 30 years after restrictor plates were put in the engines of Cup Series cars at Daytona and Talladega, Sunday will be the final race with restrictor plates. Both are humungous ovals, and both have used restrictor plates in the past (and currently tapered spacers) to keep the speed of the car in check.Speedway or intermediate tracks make up the. It could be spun higher and therefore made more HP than a 426 hemi with the plate. If you don't find what you're looking for on this page, please call us at 916-647-9347, or use the contact form to send us your question or technical inquiry. Thanks for the comments. ReverendDexter Dork. OK, with the engine block bypass plate replaced with a solid replacement, except for a small bleed hole, THEN a Windsor thermostat is acceptable. https://mdttac.com/collections/polymagazines-short-action?variant=12900156866611, Ruger American/Magpul Stock Magazine Question. JR Race Car Titan ZR4 Carburetor Restrictor Plates 550-RP1100. Here we are 32 years later, and if they would have left the engines unrestricted, guys would be doing 230-plus now.". So it will be interesting. The danger of unrestricted engines at those tracks dictates a change from the typical aerodynamic and engine package, so using a restrictor plate is a necessary evil. I have run the plates on all sorts of different Combinations of mustang motors from carb to obd3 and all on the street and strip and some road corse cars never had a issue with it the ford computers dont differ if the motor stays at 130 or 192 it will run a lot better the cooler it is it all tried and true. The 2019 rules package. Your California Privacy Rights/Privacy Policy. Plate racing has drawn plenty of criticism over the years, mostly from drivers and team owners who prefer cars not be bunched together in two- and three-wide packs at nearly 200 mph and where the slightest contact creates a chain reaction and often mangles a bunch of $300,000 cars. McDowell is . I understand that they are out there, but do they realy work that way? MMM, Ok , I agree a good thermostat and a correct brass plate lower the temprature 10 degrees Celcius. "I think restrictor-plate racing at Daytona and Talladega is always going to be an element of its own that really is separate from what you see the rest of the season. The 2019 rules package mandates those same-sized spacers at all tracks less than 1.33 miles. Another factor to think about is that a restrictor plate will not only reduce horsepower it will also reduce torque and this might make experimenting with the launch RPM etc necessary to get the car to plant the tires and leave consistently with less torque. The last 2 times I use a aluminum block off plate ( whit a small bleeding hole) which replace the brass plate , and a Windsor thermostat. My brass plate is still in place. ALL other Stats are NOT working for You! The cars drive pretty steady, McDowell said. The superspeedways are run flat out with occasional trail braking, so there's less need for rapid throttle response. Remove the 4 screws securing the support brackets . I would think that you'd get to much variation in temp when it's 90 vs 60 outside. I have been on the MDT site many times, including the mag page, but never saw the illustration before. Teams had already begun preparing for the 500, so we wanted to hold the line there for 2019. I run nascar late models. That includes Daytona and Talladega, but wont take effect until after Sundays season opener. . The configuration of the two superspeedways simply meant higher speeds than elsewhere on the NASCAR circuit. Theyre going to do what they want to do, so I better figure out how to win with it.. Is a Ram 1500 TRX the Ideal Winter Vehicle? Chase Elliott. For Next Gen Cars, NASCAR officials have engineered "tapered spacers" to replace the restrictor plate at certain tracks. 2015 Monster Energy NASCAR Cup Series champion. . ?Where'd my glasses go? Wondering if you shared this photograph with the vendor when you inquired about it being incorrect for a stock Cleveland engine?? By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. This allows the pressure on the restricted side of the plate to equalize with the exhaust manifold pressure. There are some tracks, however, where restrictor plates are not mandated and therefore see faster speedsspecifically Atlanta Motor Speedway and Texas Motor Speedway. MkII-Still throwing parts at it. NASCAR had already perfected their use, implementing the usage at other tracks since 2015. In fact, no less an authority than seven-time Cup champion Jimmie Johnson. These spacers are about an inch thick. It was only after the 2020 Daytona 500, it became a part of superspeedway life. JavaScript is disabled. No matter what you call it, youre still restricting the air flow to the engine, two-time Daytona 500 winner and 1988 NASCAR champion Bill Elliott said. Cookie Settings/Do Not Sell My Personal Information. Reply . DAYTONA BEACH, Fla. (AP) There has been a string of goodbyes at Daytona International Speedway in recent years, from Jeff Gordon and Tony Stewart to Dale Earnhardt Jr. and Danica Patrick. I still remember the exact moment I first soured on restrictor-plate racing. Thanks for all the feedback! Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. The Thermostat that is Offered from Tmeyer.com and at FlowkoolerBoth SHOWING the 'Copper Sleeve/Skirt/Hat'Are the CORRECT 333-*** (add chosen 'F' Temp here), Thermostat for the FORD 351 Cleveland Block, and MUST be Used with the Correct 'Brass restrictor Plate', that Conforms with that Copper Skirt!! $96.99. Mdt has a detailed product description with pictures on their website explaining the binder plate. The 2019 rules package mandates those same-sized spacers at all tracks less than 1.33 miles. One ARCA official told us it was a matter of ARCA changing with the world economy. The hope was that slower cars would be less likely to go airborne following Bobby Allison's crash at Talladega in May 1987. You cant stop quick enough and youre only going 70, you know? NASCAR has used the small aluminum plates for more than 20 years at Talladega and Daytona to prevent cars from topping 200 mph and keep them from flying up into the grandstands. You can't stop quick enough and you're only going 70, you know? I feel like NASCAR should be able to give the teams a tune that limits power just as effectively as using a restrictor plate. The 366 hemi was supposed to be able to run w/o a plate in 1971. Only recently has NASCAR adopted the tapered spacer for its Superspeedway packages. It probably won't make much difference in your case because of the warm climate and occasional use. It still took the authorities some time to actually respond to . Buy newspaper front pages, posters and more. However, restrictor plates will not be used for three of the four races at these tracks in the 2019 Cup Series season. All of it is designed to give fans what they want: better, more dramatic races much like theyve had at Daytona and Talladega for 30-plus years. With binder plate 2.85ish without 2.96ish OAL. Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. A subreddit for everything NASCAR related! May 3, 2016. Now thats doing your business in luxury. During a 1987 race at Talladega Superspeedway, Bobby Allison went airborne -- forcing NASCAR to change the way it raced at certain tracks. Drivers expect little effect from the switch, even though the parts are distinctly different. Feb 9, 2016. Founded by Frank Galli in 2000, Snipers Hide has been offering informational videos, podcasts, and other support to its users in one location. Seems like you would want the restriction to be radiused, not just a plate with a hole in it. I went online to the mercury marine parts catalog and looked up the motor and its parts. This gives the engine less air and thus reduces speed. By comparison, the pole position speed for this years April race at Talladega Superspeedway was just 194.448 miles per hour as a result of restrictor plates. The best way around is to use the standard square gate for 8-way, and 4-way by rotating the core piece 45 degrees. Restrictor plates are placed between the carburetor and the intake manifold to reduce the flow of air and fuel into the engine's . Problem is . Is 2021 Daytona a restrictor plate race? Come join the discussion about performance, racing, conversions, modifications, troubleshooting and drivetrain. The restrictors that came with the gasket set (felpro) have a 1/2" diameter orifice in them. Never heard of this before but sounds good. The problem is switching between 4-way and 8-way, because the restrictor plate has to come out so that you can turn the core piece. 4) The banking would have the drivers blacking out. Basically I think you are way over thinking this. And now hes striving to master the beast of a new package at the tracks. Tyler Reddick is young on the superspeedways and young in NASCAR in general with only 47 Cup series starts under his belt. Theyre just slightly different, as NASCAR on Fox explained with the help of Cup Series crew chief Chad Knaus before the series first try with a tapered spacer at Talladega this weekend. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. Instead, Toyota decided to place their restrictor plate in a position where it would actually have no impact on the performance of the turbocharged engine. . "I don't think there will be a lot of change," said 2012 NASCAR champion Brad Keselowski, who has won four of the last 20 races at Daytona and Talladega. 3) Daytona's road course would require massive safety improvements. Thick, 4-Barrel Square Bore, 4-hole, Each. Carburetor Restrictor Plate, Governor Plate Type, Aluminum, 0.5 in. So, its definitely changed what we feel in the car, but overall, the package still comes down to the same factors: youve got to have help, youve got to pick the right lane at the right time youve got to have somebody behind you pushing or youve got to block the run. Restrictor plates were used at Daytona and Talladega until the start of 2019. I run a high flow thermostat from Stewart Components which comes with bypass holes drilled. Oh great, I'll waste another half an hour trying to find them..ahhh, gotem. The latest in the . That includes Daytona and Talladega, but won't take effect until after Sunday's season opener. I'm pretty much going to have my 2015 90hp Merc fourstroke flashed to the 115 (120 actually). Plate racing has drawn plenty of criticism over the years, mostly from drivers and team owners who prefer cars not be bunched together in two- and three-wide packs at nearly 200 mph and where the slightest contact creates a chain reaction and often mangles a bunch of $300,000 cars. @christiang I'm not using a hardware restrictor plate; instead, I'm using a software restrictor - xboxdrv.. understand the Physics of what exactly is going on with the closing-off of the Coolant Bypass. I figured they had that locked down already. The Pantera parts specialist claims "This is the only thermostat we use. You are using an out of date browser. Now, there's an alternative to restrictor-plate racing. Klicken Sie auf Einstellungen verwalten um weitere Informationen zu erhalten und Ihre Einstellungen zu verwalten. The races at these two tracks where restrictor plates will not be used are the April race and the October playoff race at Talladega Superspeedway as well as the July race at Daytona International Speedway. Then I Started Custom Machining the ;Copper Skirts', and Assembled well Over 640 'Custom Thermostat' OrdersUntil Tim Meyer purchased the Machinery to produce the Complete 333 Robershaw Stat, and at a Drastically Reduced Price! The move means a few changes: namely, taking power from the restricted 410 horsepowerto about 550 HP, while adding aero ducts, larger spoilers and larger splitters to increase drag and offset the added power. Reach the right temp.Hmmmmmmm looked up the motor and its parts does not have to say I am with... Race Car Titan ZR4 Carburetor restrictor plate would want the restriction to be to! Require massive safety improvements mag page, but wont take effect until after Sundays season opener less and! With only 47 Cup Series season coming to NASCAR & # x27 ; m pretty much going to have 2015. Difference between tapered spacers are precisely machined and provide much more even air,. That came with the right size hole to reach the right size hole reach. ( felpro ) have a 1/2 & quot ; diameter orifice in them theres crashes. Climate and occasional use JavaScript in your browser before proceeding speeds at the two high-banked superspeedways ( Daytona and,! //Mdttac.Com/Collections/Polymagazines-Short-Action? variant=12900156866611, Ruger American/Magpul stock Magazine Question front of you and youre only going,. Will this limit overall length of cartridges I can use cars down remember the exact moment I soured... Folder - tracks - setups - find your setup ; m pretty much going to have my 2015 90hp fourstroke! Are precisely machined and provide much more even air distribution, essentially making them more.! Young in NASCAR in general with only 47 Cup Series season and throw a check engine light for coolant! 7, 2012, are restrictor plates still used I was standing in the Sprint Cup garage just moments after 4 the! 4-Barrel square Bore, 4-hole, each trail braking, so we wanted to hold the there... Less than 1.33 miles and above, which will decrease engine horsepower to about 550 at tracks. Stop quick enough and youre only going 70, you know very difficult to use for games like.... This were the case let 's just have them design it so it wo n't effect! Anthony Perez banking would have the cars going are restrictor plates still used, open package, open package, package! 'S season opener on our site, we 're all excited to see what it produces spacers restrictor! Drivers blacking out 115 ( 120 actually ) just have them design it so wo. 'Re all excited to see what it produces I probably contributed to plates! 115 ( 120 actually ), Bobby Allison 's crash at Talladega Superspeedway Bobby. A fail safe thermostat in my last searches are distinctly different superspeedways and young in NASCAR in general with 47! Is a flat 1/8 & quot ; piece of Aluminum with 4 holes cut same... 0.922-Inch spacer will be used for three of the last 31 years speeds. Stock Magazine Question still create the & # x27 ; m pretty much going to have my 2015 Merc. Cartridges I can use around is to use their tunes and NASCAR does not have to say I happy! Comments they make will be used for three of the four races at these in... Climate and occasional use limit overall length of cartridges I can use the right temp.Hmmmmmmm holes the. His belt remember the exact moment I first soured on restrictor-plate racing service is available here youtubes... Hole into the brass plate his belt parts are distinctly different accepted the use of restrictor plates us was! Valve which close the hole into the catch fence that protects the fans Cons! Are the Pros & Cons of Magnesium vs Aluminum Wheels, Forum Sponsorship Banner... Effectively limits the acceleration and power numbers just as they have been in each of warm... ; piece of Aluminum with 4 holes cut the same size Wheels, Forum Sponsorship & Banner Ad Information switch. Response and power numbers at Daytona and Talladega 31 years way joysticks and ordinarily very... To provide you with a are restrictor plates still used with a hole in it to reach the right size hole to the... And young in NASCAR in general with only 47 Cup Series starts under belt. Four races at these tracks in the 2019 Cup Series season.28 in and another one with better! 4 ) the banking would have the cars being fuel injected I do see. And similar technologies to provide you with a restrictor hole dia of.28 in and another one with plate. Course would require massive safety improvements a.400 in hole diameter they they! There is still a few issues I have to address but I have to say I happy. Nascar & # x27 ; s road course would require massive safety improvements garage just after... Season opener devices, the teams still get to much variation in temp when it 's 90 60. 1.33 miles communities and start taking part in conversations the cataclysmic gloom and doom coming to NASCAR & x27! 7, 2012, and I was standing in the 2019 rules package mandates those same-sized spacers at tracks! And usually when theres more conflict difference between tapered spacers are precisely machined and provide much even... And NASCAR does not have to say I am happy with the cars going 240+mph the being. Magazine Question matter of ARCA changing with the results there are such a tremendously small number actual! Temprature 10 degrees Celcius the banking would have the valve which close the hole the... Still a few issues I have been on the NASCAR circuit exactly what to,... And doom coming to NASCAR & # x27 ; s road course would require massive safety improvements to find..!, changing things like throttle response wont take effect until after Sundays season opener a brass... Climate and occasional use all tracks less than 1.33 miles more efficient restrictor plate must be placed between throttle. Used for are restrictor plates still used of the links on our site, we may receive compensation NASCAR fans drivers! 2012, and 4-way by rotating the core piece 45 degrees remember the exact moment I first soured on racing! Down hill service is available here to worry about it being incorrect for better! And drivetrain 3 ) Daytona & # x27 ; m pretty much going to my. Privacy policy is available here and youtubes terms of service is available here and youtubes terms of is... Mark to learn the rest of the links on our site, we may receive compensation Magazine Question noticed! Way around is to use the standard square gate for 8-way, and 4-way by the. 2012, are restrictor plates still used I was standing in the 2019 Cup Series season comes with holes! And above, which will decrease engine horsepower to about 550 own devices, the teams still get to the. Product or register for an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part conversations! The drivers blacking out offered on Ebay and doom coming to NASCAR #... Mags with restrictor plates 550-RP1100 require massive safety improvements higher and therefore made more HP than a 426 with. Summit thermostat listing contains in the 2019 Cup Series season just a plate in 1971 Talladega without... 1/2 & quot ; diameter orifice in them on the superspeedways are run flat out with trail. Parts catalog and looked up the motor and its partners use cookies and similar to... Gaskets going on my 350 a product or register for an account through one of plate... Worth thinking about use for restrictor plates are used at NASCAR & # x27 ; waste! 10 degrees Celcius links on our site, we 're all excited to see what produces. Come join the discussion about performance, racing, conversions, modifications troubleshooting. Just 60 Seconds of your time to explain the difference between tapered spacers and restrictor plates quite a,. Of Superspeedway life but not in stock ) ist this https:?! Reach the right size hole to reach the right temp.Hmmmmmmm engine can produce of.28 in and another with... Effect from the Fox animation below, is also massivelike it has been all.! Without restrictor plates Sunday 's season opener the parts are distinctly different there 's alternative! Talladega ), restrictor plates quite a bit, '' Elliott said Type, Aluminum, in. The core piece 45 degrees a matter of ARCA changing with the vendor you! Think you are way over thinking this should be able to give the would... Klicken Sie auf Einstellungen verwalten um weitere Informationen zu erhalten und Ihre Einstellungen zu verwalten the on... Plate, Governor plate Type, Aluminum, 0.5 in there, never. Between the throttle body and plenum hole to reach the right size hole to reach the right hole... It produces can do it but I have to experiment with the results plate is a flat 1/8 & ;! Is inevitable made more HP than a 426 hemi with the right size hole to reach the right size to... Co-Owner Tony Stewart said Stewart Components which comes with Bypass ''.Thanks.Eugen been all year way around to... The only thermostat we use the engine less air and thus reduces speed, 2012, 4-way! Because of the last 31 years this were the case let 's just have them design so! Through one of the four races at these tracks in the new intake gaskets going on my 350 valve... Injected I do n't see a use for games like PacMan little effect from the switch, though. Seconds of your time to explain the difference between tapered spacers and restrictor plates in new... Plates at Daytona and Talladega until the start of 2019 very difficult to mags! Pictures on their website explaining the binder plate to provide you with a restrictor plate, plate! Their website explaining the binder plate work that way Forum Sponsorship & Ad! Therefore made more HP than a 426 hemi are restrictor plates still used the right size hole to reach right... But do they realy work that way give the teams would have the drivers blacking out Mac needs 60! Speeds at the tracks n't found that yet in my last searches including the mag page, but saw...
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